The Honest Filmmaker
Are you about to leave Uni with a filmmaking degree? Or want to change careers and work in a creative industry? We want to give you the tools you need to enter the real world of production or freelancing. Honest and open career advice from people in the business.
We also talk to those in other creative industries to discuss their careers, the potential cross over with film production and practical tips for a successful and fulfilling career.
http://www.thehonestfilmmaker.co.uk
The Honest Filmmaker
What to expect from the American Film Market and how to write, fund, shoot and sell your debut feature film with Tom Malloy
#filmmaking #podcast #americanfilmmarket #afm
This week on the podcast I'm talking to filmmaker Tom Malloy. Tom has a huge string of credits starting as an actor he then went onto produce films. He's written and sold screenplays, raised finance for movies and he's also directed.
I asked Tom about his route into the industry and we also went through the whole process of a production with all his tips on writing, casting, financing, production, sales and distribution for anyone wanting to work on their debut feature film. He also talked to me about what to expect at the American Film Market (AFM) this year. We covered everything from the pros and cons of AFM vs. Cannes, helping filmmakers decide which market is the best fit for their projects. Tom shared powerful tips on sales and distribution strategies, along with insider advice on which genres are selling at AFM right now—and how much action really makes a difference in indie films.
We also dug into the real frustrations low-budget filmmakers face with sales agents, with Tom offering advice on how to push past these hurdles. If you’re heading to AFM or just want to learn the secrets to breaking into the film market, this conversation is a must-listen for anyone serious about their filmmaking career.
Tom's website: https://www.filmmakingstuffhq.com
Tom's Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/filmmakingstuff
The American Film Market: https://americanfilmmarket.com
Check out the re-release of Jim's first solo directing feature The Witches Hammer - out now on amazon
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/video/detail/B0F235F4T8/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r
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HONEST, OPEN ADVICE ABOUT YOUR FILMMAKING CAREER
Are you about to leave Uni with a filmmaking degree? Or want to change careers and work in a creative industry? We want to give you the tools you need to enter the real world of production or freelancing. Honest and open career advice from people in the business.
We also talk to those in other creative industries to discuss their careers, the potential cross over with film production and practical tips for a successful and fulfilling career.
Join the community: http://www.thehonestfilmmaker.co.uk
[Music] hi Jim here and you're listening to the honest filmmaker podcast career advice from people in the business this week I'm speaking to filmmaker Tom Malloy Tom has a huge string of credits starting as an actor he then went on to produce films he's written and sold screenplays he's raised Finance for movies and he's also directed I asked Tom about his route into the industry and we also went through the whole process of production with all of his tips on writing casting financing uh production sales and distribution and film festivals for anyone wanting to work on their debut feature enjoy talk me through your route into film Mak it well I was always had had it in my mind to be an actor from the time I was really young and I did a film in 1998 I believe called Graves end and uh we shot it it was my first you know like act experience other than the stage and you know i' been performing on stage as a little kid um but I was 19 and we shot on the streets of Brooklyn and we would just go up to a street corner there'd be a gang of thugs and we'd be like you guys want to shoot a fight scene and they'd be like yeah you know and a big big fight and break out and but when it was done we got Oliver Stone to put his name on the movie and so was in theaters wow that being said when that came out I thought oh wow I'm never gonna have to be anything but an actor and when that didn't happen a couple years later I just decided I didn't want to be a waiter bartender I wanted to learn everything else about film making so I just decided to be an actor writer producer when no one was doing that I remember I had an agent at the time that said you know well you have to focus on one of those things and I guarantee that same agent now would say you have to do everything you can't just be one of those things and uh so I kind of trailblazed that and so that's the beginning B but then that was that was the foray into it and now I've just produced my 27th movie I've options sold made the movies 25 of about 30 so scripts and um you know I own Glass House distribution Distribution Company and so yeah rolling along and I've been in you know maybe 40 movies as an actor so yeah yeah I can attest to that because I do my usual bit of digging on indb and it's a very full page your page there a lot of lot of credits lot of films lot of Productions um and obviously you've got your YouTube channel podcast course all on film making so I thought what I would do is we would go through making a film we're going to make a film together and I'm going to I'm going to ask you for some tips along the way yes yes of course so okay so the the first the most obvious one for me is I'm writing a script what are some of the mistakes people make at that at that point in the process I'd say the one of the first mistakes that they make is that they don't take time to read scripts beforehand especially reading scripts in the same genre as whatever they're trying to make um I'll still do that I've been in the writer's Guild for 20 plus years I will still do that if you if you commission me to write like for example there was just recently these guys asked me to potentially write a script about a hockey team in the US and the true story behind it before I write that if it's if comes to fruition I'll read one or two films if I can find something about hockey but it's something about like building a sports franchise script and so that I go okay that's how it's laid out especially a successful one a one that you really like but so that's really it's not like you're copying it or anything but you're just giving an getting an idea of how that flowed and that's successful so why not try to model it somewhat in the same structure and the same tone yeah agreed uh reading scripts is good and also it's it can be really good experience reading a script as well it's kind of like reading a book really quickly you can quite enjoy especially if it's like an Oscar winning uh script you know it's there's it's great and you know it's funny so many people that I you know I wrote a script and uh I go hey how much do you read scripts they said I don't read scripts and it's like that's the equivalent of like you know I just this morning I was at the dentist that's the equivalent of like watching them and going I could read this you know what I mean like you're not you know so people watch a movie and they get an idea for a cool movie in their head and then they just decide that they're going to do it and it's like you really should learn the the the rules first about screenwriting and go into it that way yeah absolutely and thinking I'm thinking about this script even at that stage genre I'm making a lowbudget filmm by the way I'm making a mic low budget film does genre matter well should I be aiming at a genre 100% you know the one thing that I would say is like I tell people they make an action movie I know it's tough micro budget but uh horror Thriller sci-fi uh or if you're gonna if you really want to do a drama or you really want to do a comedy make them vanilla like I just produced a comedy and there was like no curse words no sex no nothing in it because those are sellable worldwide the second the joke is everybody wants to make the edgy drama and the edgy comedy like every first filmmaker wants to make that edgy drama with the cursing and the sex and the drugs and all that stuff and those are the least likely to sell and make sales so I just say just try to stay away from those okay fine make a drama but make it a more familyfriendly and it doesn't have to be all you know Wine and Roses or whatever but it has to be at Le you know just pull back on the cursing come back on the drug and the sex shoes you know what I mean so that's what I would say and he's that um probably putting your distribtion and sales hat on is that because the buyers don't want that or the streaming platforms they don't want swearing they don't want new I'd say that it's more for I mean the some of the streaming platforms yes but then also it's more for international sales you know it's like there the second you have a edgy drama it's just you're killing your sales in the Middle East you're killing your sales in Africa you're killing your sales in China if you know it's harder and harder to sell to China these days but you know those were things things that you just like they have a sensor board and you can't get past those so why not set yourself up for more success and still try to tell your story without putting all that edginess in it it's it's just it doesn't they don't play even you know even us they just they're very tougher they're much tougher to sale interesting and um then going on to so I've got my script I've chosen my genre the worst my least favorite part of the whole process raising Finance give me what's the Magic Bullet For That G I don't know what if I can give you one Magic Bullet you know I wrote the book on film financing called bankroll and that was the best seller of you know 2008 and 2012 now it's everything's on film making stuff which is we put it all online and I'm sure that's yeah that's right you found me through film making stuff film making stuff HQ which is the membership site and you know what I tell people is that you know film investment is very fun for high net worth individuals h& if you get get them involved you get them excited but at the same time you have to make it make sense you have to structure a project in a way where it just makes sense that it's potentially going to make money you know and and that's not you as a filmmaker going well I just I'm gonna do this for a million why why a million well because that's you the budget I thought of and I'm gonna cast unknowns but really good actors and I'm going to make my edgy drama and is going to win the Oscar and if you do that great congratulations you've proven the wrong but most likely you're going to lose somebody a lot of money and then you're going to be looking for other investors so try to make a viable project that makes sense and if you can make a project where it makes sense on paper investors start to pop up it just becomes irresistible and is there a is there a sweet price point do you think of or budget level for micro and low budget well a lot of it depends on the scope of the movie meaning you know how many characters locations everything but but I would say these days it's like there you you have to almost look at it I look at it like three cogs right like you this big gear and I have like like I have a studio project that's slowly it's a slow gear that's you know that's 30 million and up then you have those medium ones and I did two of those last year where I ended up bringing some money to I was one of the EPS uh and you know maybe anywhere from the two to5 million range and those you really need a studio behind it even today now I don't mean a huge Studio but like a tub or a um you know Hulu or an Amazon you somebody like that that's going to jump on the micro budgets got the joke is it just keeps getting less and less if this was five years ago I would have said under 300,000 if this was 10 years ago I would say under a million now I'm GNA say be smart under 50 60,000 you know I did a course on filmmaking stuff called backyard Blockbuster and that's what I was talking about it was that you know you can pull a you could pull a great movie together for that price if you know what you're doing yeah absolutely and uh so I've got my money I've raised my finance thank god um now I'm on to Casting any tips for that and and you do you think I should be going after names you know what what give me some advice a lot of times with the micro budgets is tough to do like the union but if you're out in UK maybe you could get around that you know get around the Screen Actors Guild but so there are some people that work nonunion they work Fiore and they'll do you know non-union as well as Union stuff so so much of it is relationships like this last movie I did was a small film The the vanilla type comedy and so I reached out to a couple of my union friends I said this is non-union just FYI and they the two that I know they were you know well-known actors they didn't want to do it um but some don't mind they may be fi core they may just not care it's okay you know it's it it's it people need to understand the union can't do anything your film they could they could theoretically go after the actor but they don't they never have never heard one person ever getting in trouble but you know they they go after if they were doing it for big money but anyway long story short is that you getting celebrities and names yes you should I mean how do I do it if when it's super low relationships just friends and um I'm in that kind of scene and I'm out in Los Angeles so those are the things but if you do more markets and film festivals you start to formulate these relationships but it all goes down to them believing in the script and you as a director filmmaker that's what they have to believe in and then actors want to work in good projects doesn't matter the money especially if they're celebrities they don't care as much about the money they care about good projects yeah very true um so in this imaginary project I'll skip to production and I know I can't ask you for a million tips for production that's a big chunk but what is there is there anything you wish you'd known before you started making films about the production process well specifically to the production process I would say this is funny don't get too excited when you're shooting I think that everybody does and I've seen it now with when I produce a movie and somebody is their first movie you know some investor or some you know some filmmaker and it's like I I just remember reading years ago in Michael Kane's great book acting in film that everybody like buys the yachts and Ferraris when they're shooting and then they sell all when they see the assembly edit and it's true I mean my friend I Robins a producer said he's never not cried in an assembly edit but I know that's a joke but the key is once you see it it's like you go there's a lot of work to do you know what I mean and it's it's almost like you're trying to make this statue of David and you see the assembly and it's a big rock that might have starts of the shape of a head and starts of shape and then you go okay we got to edit this and that's when you realize film making is an editor's medium and that you have to understand that that that's really what counts is how they put that together you could take the best dailies ever and make a horrible movie and you could take mediocre dailies and make something that's awesome yeah very true I've been in that situation myself where you've come home you've cut it together and you've gone oh no what is this and then you spend the whole year I wish I shot that or I wish I did that yeah St yeah yeah in the editing sweet that's Grim um so then say I've cut my film together plays with it film festivals for micro budget is it worth doing film festivals it's a good question is it it depends on how you're defining worth like if it's worth is it worth it for you as a filmmaker to meet people and get connections and get Awards and things yes is it worth it for sales of the movie probably not unless you're in the top five to 10 film festivals you know there just a very small list and very tough to get into so I would say do it for different reasons if the if you're believing in that old tale of like go to Sund Dan get the bidding war and it's like yeah that happens one out of you know 300,000 movies and so it's to me it's do that but at the same time focus on the distribution getting your going to film markets and meeting the sales and distribution people and getting a sales agent on board getting a distributor on board and thinking about it from a marketing perspective like how are you going to get that film out there and and making money so yeah and so you brought up film markets um obviously ifms coming up um which is one I've not been to before tell me tell me about AFM what would I is it worth a filmmaker going first of all and what should they expect what should they be doing yes well I haven't um been there either except for 20 years in a row so no all right I literally um no I went the first time in 2005 and I'm like I'll never not go to this I was just like I enamored and now funny enough I'll be in can uh Friday I leave Friday and I'll be there till the 24th or 25th and um that's for mipcom which is another market and more TV oriented Market but uh yeah AFM for a filmmaker you know walking in it's just like you feel like it's the New York Stock Exchange of the movie business and it's it's really where you see you like you you think oh I have this idea for a chainsaw horror movie and then you walk in to where it used to be in the Lowe's and you see posters for 20 other chainsaw horror movies and you go oh okay you know like guess and so I think it's very important in my estimation for a filmmaker to experience that or can maybe not Berlin as much Berlin's a little bit more targeted but I would say mated film in can and may or the American Film Market just to go there and go okay this is how the business side of it works so then you can kind of start to back in and understand the process because as a filmmaker or as a director a producer something like that many of them don't understand that they we put a million dollars in this movie we'll make it make an edgy drama it's like yeah and then we'll just you know we'll take it to Sundance we'll win Sundance we'll get 20 million done and it's like that's not a plan and it's it's not gonna happen so if you understand the market aspect of it you can probably be way more prepared yeah definitely so I I would say I'm similar to you but mine is can because obviously it's a lot closer so that's where I would used to go single year absolutely love it and I think also it's such an energy boost as well when you come out of there and you've you're surrounded by creative surrounded by people are also making movies I love it yeah I mean I used to say like k um and I think I've been 12 times there and uh but I I used to say I come back with a stack of business cards now there's no not as many business cards because a lot of people are doing digital stuff but it's uh but either way you you just get you got that feeling of these are people that are doing stuff and I want to be part of it so no I love the ma film I mean it's it'd be tough for me to miss that yeah I love it which um out of the two which do you think is better for a micr budget filmmaker can or AFM dep for an American micr budget filmmaker or I'd even extend that to a UK so I'd say an English-speaking movie I'd say American Film Market is better you know because if you if you have a foreign if you're French movie if you're Spanish movie no I definitely can't definitely can't anything with English speaking movie um I would say AFM is just better that's what because they the buyers know that's what's going to be there yeah interesting interesting so um so sales and distribution again that's a dangerous part of the process because you can really mess up there any what are your tips for that well do your research on each company you know it's like if you go to Sando C Ando that's the database of the uh film sales agents and Distributors so look and see what movies they've done and then I I always said that I just put this in an email to somebody like never ask for references and in fact in general that's a dumb practice because no one's going to give you bad references if you ask me for references I'm G to give you people that are going to speak highly of me so it's better to just look and see the movies find out of the producers and reach out to those people I'm guaranteed they'll be happy to say if they had a good experience or a bad experience with that company and so if you do that you get some kind of perspective on it um so that's that's your best way to check them out I I don't believe the kind of filmmaker belief or lack of better word that there are sales agents Distributors out to screw them I think that probably yeah there's five or so that might be unscrupulous but most cases people filmmakers don't realize sometimes that there's nothing they can do with the movie you made a movie about some Shakespeare and you updated it you put all kinds of curses and stuff and you're mad when the the statement says you only made $5,000 and it's like you know oh the distributor screwed me it's like nope they didn't do anything they tried their best um you know I had I remember we've had we have 193 movies now and I think about all the movies that we also had we had one edgy drama that I really liked but it was kind of a street drug type movie and those filmmakers just thought their movie was going to make millions of dollars and we were excited about it but everybody passed on that movie everybody passed but they got you know they kind of flipped out on us afterwards like you know you screwed us they that type of thing and they were the film that we said after this we're going to show every filmmaker all the meetings we took where they requested your movie because it's like I could show you 30 companies and we got zero sales that ain't on us dude these are 30 companies that we pitched the hell out of your movie like it was the greatest things in sliced bread they all watch the screener blah blah blah so since that those idiots we obviously let their film go but from now on we take every movie we show all the meetings that we did where they requested it so you know that if if you get zero sales it's like no we did our job it's like the buyers just for some reason didn't fit their schedule the movie didn't flow they just didn't you know wasn't right their budgets were that's why they didn't pick it up so yeah well that's interesting to know and I wish maybe more sales and distribution were that open with that information because I I guess as a filmmaker sometimes it is frustrating obviously you you hand your film over and you just crush your fingers and hope they're they're out there pushing it for you so you don't sometimes get that real time feedback as to well that's why you know I started the company with a guy named Brian glass and that's why it's called glass house but it became the double on Tandra of full transparency we go here it is you can see everything going on inside and just watch us doing and so yeah we try to do stuff that's a little bit different so people can feel like at least they're because I I found that many times or at least most times as long as you're communicating with the filmmakers then they're okay if it's not a success you know they get it it's unfortunate but then they get it but you know it's when you're hiding that information or you're unreachable that's where the filmmaker start to freak out yeah definitely and going into AFM is there any particular type of film or genre that you think's going to sell well well always action I I just it's just hilarious that every buyer we go so you know say it's a new buyer we don't know them we go what J was you looking for the first word out of their mouth all action you know it's like it's so funny that they say that again that's the hardest to shoot micro budget but if you can find a way to do it um you you probably have some potential money on your hand because we we even had a couple action movies that were not good and they still made a lot of money so yeah oh really so so are you when you're talking how much action have I got to put in it to call it an action has it got to have martial arts do it got guns in well one or the other or both you know it's yes is the is the answer because I'm I'm thinking of another movie that tried to approach us as an action movie that was really a drama with a little bit of Gunplay you know what I mean it's like come on as an action movie but I'd say that um but the joke is that movie still did sell okay because we were we the trailer was heavily action oriented but um I would say yeah it has to have you know 20 30% shooting in martial arts in it to make it action so I hope you enjoyed that episode if you'd like to hear from more industry professionals how they got into the business and how you can do the same or you just want to listen to some cool stories from movie sets around the world then please do subscribe to the honest filmmaker podcast [Music]
